I have some experience under my belt with these supplements already. I found them overall harmful to my body - every one of them. This means my ratios were off. I mostly failed to consume all three together. Large amounts of any one without equally large amounts of the others can destroy the body, I have found. My body is still recovering, and thus, problems with supplements become evident very quickly.
Last blood test was on December 2 (6 days ago).
Vitamin D level: 30ng/ml (borderline low). Same as on October 10.
Blood Calcium Level: 9.3 (normal; down from 9.8).
Today is my first day back on the K2 supplement wagon. I’ve decided upon this after having some minor positive results from small amounts of K2 and D3 via foods. So far I have only taken one supplement today aside from my daily multi, along with breakfast.
Multi: Adult Gummy
Supplement: 100mcg K2 MK-4 plus 1000IU D3
Took this supplement almost an hour ago. Tried to eat a moderate amount of calcium along with it. Calcium intake was probably under or around 20% DV.
Result thus far: Something is obviously off. I am experiencing various minor negative symptoms. Joint pains coming and going. Pain in the bones themselves, briefly. A little bit of itchiness in various places. Weird pain in wrist tendon. The usual tension felt in mid-back from this particular supplement is there, though currently mild. Some lower abdominal pain (presumably kidneys) which I usually get from this supplement and believe is due to its magnesium stearate contents.
Impossible to say exactly why, but the ratio is not right. It could be that the K2 ratio is too low, the D3 ratio is too high or too low, or that the calcium ratio is too high (each in relation to the other two). I am positive that the itchiness is a result of calcium and/or oxidation deposits in the skin. Calcium could be deposited there due to consuming too much calcium in relation to the D3 and/or K2. In the past, I hypothesized that the mid-back pain was due to the relative lack of calcium, but this now seems contradictory. I also got similar back pain from taking too many magnesium supplements and believed this was due to the fact that magnesium lowers blood calcium, causing the body to draw calcium out of the bone and muscle and into the bloodstream. I do not believe that D3 by itself causes this since I have tried D3 by itself and never experienced it. Consumption of cheese/natto with K2 MK-7 and obviously high calcium also did not produce this result, as far as I recall. Since I believe the K2 depletes Vitamin D (based on experience and research), this might suggest that the Vitamin D is too low (which it could also be due to my borderline deficiency baseline).
Bone pain could be caused by dearth or excess of D: I have heard of D deficient people reporting severe bone pain; conversely, insufficient K2 with D3 can (if I recall my research correctly) result in the D3 simply drawing calcium out of the bones and muscles and getting deposited improperly.
The itchiness could also be due to oxidation. I believe that calcium combined with iron probably caused a terrible oxidation of my body leading to itchiness. I had been taking iron supplements due to slight iron deficiency. My hemoglobin then normalized and then I developed an array of symptoms shortly. I know most of these were caused by other things, but iron probably played some role. Last time I took an iron pill, it made me extremely tired, caused a little joint pain, and I think a little itchiness. So I believe most of the itchiness was caused by calcium because cheese with no iron definitely makes me itchy, but iron may have contributed some since I took a multi with Vitamin C which enhances iron absorption.
Previous experiments with MK-4 via pastured eggs combined with D3 via tuna plus a little additional calcium suggest that this D3 level is low in relation to the K2. Each egg contains roughly 5.5 mcg MK-4, which is not much. 3oz of canned tuna contains 200IU, although I may have only eaten 2/3 of the can at once. I found that 5.5mcg MK-4 to 125IU D3 (approximations) seemed to be an excellent ratio. That is equivalent to roughly 4mcg:100IU, or 100mcg:2500IU.
Obviously these exact ratios should not be repeated. Here are some possibilities for the next experiment. I might wait a few days so as to let my body readjust to where it was. Adjustments are limited by the available supplements I possess.
- Take the pill directly after the meal instead to reduce calcium absorption.
- Consume less calcium.
- Take an additional D3 pill at the same time. 1000IU
- Eat some tuna in the meal for additional D3 in smaller amount than supplement.
- Combine this pill with a K2 MK-7 pill that contains no D3, to increase ratio of K2 to D3.
- Try getting calcium with plenty of magnesium (through food) in order to test its prevention of excessive blood calcium getting deposited in skin.
- Try to obtain some more pastured eggs (my local farmer’s market closed for the winter).
- Some combination of the above.
Due to my borderline D deficiency, it’s critical that I get enough D with every K2 supplement. My personal ratio might be higher due to the currently low D level, particularly if I want to reach the optimum baseline of 35ng/ml. I am also making sure to get some Vitamin A because it prevents the D from harming the liver.
Additional supplements I currently possess:
- 100mcg K2 MK-7 + 300mg alfalfa
- 100mcg K2 MK-7 + 1000IU D3
- 1000IU D3 (no magnesium stearate!)
- 10,000IU A + 400IU D (the ratio should be max 5000IU A per 400IU D, according to my research) from Solgar Natural
- Gummy Multi with 5000IU A
As you see, I cannot increase my K2 to D3 ratio easily, since two of my pills contain D3 at the same ratio. I’m not a fan of experimenting with MK-7 since it lasts longer in the body and is therefore difficult to measure. Also the one with alfalfa made me feel awful, although this is before I started taking Vitamin D.
Also, I believe I have suffered noticeable bone loss from K2+calcium+protein without Vitamin D. So I really want to figure out this ratio so I can reverse the process.